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Post by gtrplyr on Apr 20, 2018 7:27:50 GMT -8
Well someone has to do it ... Not much to say other than fears of lackluster iPhone numbers are putting pressure on our beloved stock. Short sighted IMHO as this will be the quarter that Apple address what they will do with the recent Tax savings. May 1st can't come soon enough. Cheers to the longs ..... Maybe we should just close up shop now and open the bar?
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Post by sponge on Apr 20, 2018 7:42:04 GMT -8
I really thought the floor would be the 20 MA. Today’s drop was very unexpected.
Last week I did expect to see 168 this week, but after climbing on Monday and Tuesday, I put those views to bed. The reason I saw 168 was because there were so many puts at 170 and the OI kept going up. Someone knew we would go down by end of week. They made 3000% in one day. Now we will see if we touch 165 which also happens to be the 200 MA.
I still feel confident about earnings. Don’t care about iPhones since the buybacks announcement should still give us a 2-4% bounce by end of earnings week.
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chinacat
Moderator
AAPL Long since 2006
Posts: 4,433
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Post by chinacat on Apr 20, 2018 7:52:22 GMT -8
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Post by gtrplyr on Apr 20, 2018 8:00:34 GMT -8
FWIW , I sold some TSLA in our IRAs this morning and picked up some AAPL. That is about all the dry powder I can muster at this point, I'm pretty confident regardless of the upcoming numbers, Apple's buybacks and dividend raise will help offset any weakness.
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ono
Member
compensation
Posts: 552
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Post by ono on Apr 20, 2018 8:06:12 GMT -8
The transcript of yesterdays TSMC earnings is now available: www.tsmc.com/tsmcdotcom/ExtIRListingQuarterlyAction.do?action=listByYearAndQuarter&year=2018&theQuarter=1&language=E#I would like to hear your opinions on just how serious the "weakness" comments are vs. the seasonality. Are they really damning, or is it their explanation a the why their previous forecast of 10%-15% growth maybe be closer to 10% because of weakness (or lack of forecast growth materializing) in mobile and crypto? Download the pdf and search "weak". My clippings: --- Moving into second quarter this year. Our business is expected to be affected by continued softer demand from Smartphone segment. This decline is expect to be partially mitigated by the strengths in HPC. Our revenue in US dollar is likely to grow by only about a 10% over second quarter last year. We forecast our fabless DOI to stay slightly above seasonal level, but will attract seasonal pattern. For the whole year of 2018, we forecast the overall semiconductor market, excluding memory, will grow by 5%, while foundry expect to grow by about a 8%. We forecast TSMC's 2018 revenue in US dollar will be about a 10%, rather than the previously indicated 10% to 15% due to the Smartphone weakness and the uncertainty in cryptocurrency mining demand.
… while we have seen some weakness in the first half for the mobile and there are certain technology of our existing customer capacity maybe not so full for the whole year and that will be one factor to our overall structural profitability. But I think our objective to maintain or improve structural profitability remain unchanged, but there are market situation and some uncertainty we have to be mindful. --- Roland Shu - Citigroup Inc, Research Division - Director and Head of Regional Semiconductor Research Okay. But last year actually, we also expanded about 15% to 20% of the capacity for 28-nanometer. So is there any problem to fulfill the capacity this year? C. C. Wei - Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Company Limited - Co-CEO, President & Additional Director Last year, we increased the capacity because of a very high demand. And a lot of customer did not hit in that wafer. That continue into this year's first quarter and probably half of this quarter. But at the end, they move forward faster than we thought. So that's why that we see a little bit weakness in the second half. [of 28-nanometer?]--- … can you clarify the -- your comment on the weak smartphone demand. Because I think now China's smartphone, at least, you see some seasonality, right? So why that is not referred to your revenue guidance upside? And according to our analysis, we think some of your customer think that die size significantly this year. Is that affect the wafer demand for you at a 16-nanometer? This is my second question. C. C. Wei - Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Company Limited - Co-CEO, President & Additional Director The question is quite long, but let me give you some explanation. Yes. We do see China as a market start to pick up in the smartphone. But in TSMC, we -- in our smartphone market segment, there is some very high end, the smartphone is a little bit soft. So that's why we projected that is going to be continuous softness. Okay. It's not because of the China market that's -- that start to pick up slowly. --- Mehdi Hosseini - Susquehanna Financial Group, LLLP, Research Division - Senior Analyst One is a follow-up clarification and one question. Just going back to your comment regarding days of inventory that we are not due in Q1. And I think Lora mentioned that they had to do with the 10-nanometer products, especially with the smartphone. Just want to make sure the weakness that you see from the smartphone market especially the premium products in the second quarter, that has to do with inventory digestion and perhaps as the new products ramp in the second half with the premium smartphone show a rebound in the second half. So in other words, is Q2 kind of a digestion, inventory digestion period? And I have a follow- up. Li Mei He Ho - Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Company Limited - CFO and SVP of Finance The days of inventory for TSMC in second quarter was 63%. First quarter, 63 days. I explained that because we are ramping down 10-nanometer capacity, and we will massively ramp up 7-nanometer capacity. So we are in a migration period. So we, on purposely, view more inventory on 10-nanometer so we can move the equipment to 7-nanometer, so we can save the CapEx. That's the thing. You're asking whether our days of inventory will go down? Not necessarily because we are ramping our 7-nanometer, which has a much longer cycle time. So I do not expect our days of inventory will go down or will change much in second half of the year. --- Sebastian Hou - CL Securities Taiwan Company Limited, Research Division - Research Analyst Okay. Second question is that if I just do some calculation on the guidance revision for this year. Earlier, it was 10% to 15% and now it's about 10%. So that probably -- if we use a midpoint, probably about close to USD 1 billion of revenue decline. And remember, the last quarter, Chairman talked about the first half year-over-year is about slightly above 15%. And now if we bake in the new guidance for second quarter plus the first quarter we already know, is about 12%. So that's about like USD 600 million full in first half. So does that mean -- and I already had mentioned about the smartphone going to be weak, and -- but which means that there were probably another USD 400 million revision -- a downward revision in second half this year. So would that be mainly driven by smartphone again or the other applications? C. C. Wei - Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Company Limited - Co-CEO, President & Additional Director I think I just described it, is a continued weakness of the smartphone demand and the uncertainty in the cryptocurrency's mining, so we adjust EBITDA. --- Mark Liu - Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Company Limited - Co-CEO, President & Additional Director Yes. The -- you questioned -- yes. We -- earlier -- the crystal ball we saw before, the smartphone going to give us, in 5 years, going to give us 50% growth dollar. Now it looks smaller like 40%, a little bit more than 40%. But HPC used to be 25%. But it looks like it going to be close to 40%. So HPC as we look at for -- it seems stronger than we saw before and smartphone a little bit weaker than way before. In IoT and automotive, it's about the same. But to be honest, this goal has a time and even in smartphone, we look at 5G transition, that will be another industry transition. If you look at the 4G transition, it's -- the demand has changed the whole landscape. So -- but that's what we look at today. And we'll go along the -- along with this industry during the migration and update for you. Yes. End of comments
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chinacat
Moderator
AAPL Long since 2006
Posts: 4,433
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Post by chinacat on Apr 20, 2018 8:33:19 GMT -8
Neil Cybart published Apple Found a Wall Street Narrative a couple of days ago, which describes how Tim Cook has slowly morphed Apple's business model to withstand the annual cyclical nature of iPhone sales. Most AFBers already know this, but it's good to be reminded at times like these.
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ono
Member
compensation
Posts: 552
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Post by ono on Apr 20, 2018 8:50:48 GMT -8
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chinacat
Moderator
AAPL Long since 2006
Posts: 4,433
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Post by chinacat on Apr 20, 2018 9:29:39 GMT -8
Siri on Apple HomePods being triggered by ad for NBA on TNT. For the Siri critics, note that "Both Amazon and Google devices are regularly triggered by accident, since Alexa and Google Assistant often come up in media like TV shows, YouTube clips, and podcasts." One of the best things about TiVo is that we rarely see any ads.
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Post by Luckychoices on Apr 20, 2018 10:02:16 GMT -8
I have tried on numerous occasions to understand what the heck bitcoin mining is with little luck. I simply do not get it, all I know is investing in it is not for me. Now iPhones and iPads I know something about .... especially the iPhone X which is simply fantastic and light years ahead of any other phone I've ever used. Using my daughter's brand new iPhone 8 seems so antiquated at this point, when and if Apple does a cheaper version of iPhoneX it will sell in record numbers. What a crappy day ..... but we are used to it ... and we are patient. Cheers to the longs I view todays drop as a gift, a buying opportunity before the May 1 earnings release and the subsequent adjustments in cash return to the shareholders. I'm all in.Other opinions? Well someone has to do it ... Not much to say other than fears of lackluster iPhone numbers are putting pressure on our beloved stock.
Short sighted IMHO as this will be the quarter that Apple address what they will do with the recent Tax savings. May 1st can't come soon enough. Cheers to the longs ..... Maybe we should just close up shop now and open the bar? Rumors and panic causing a selloff of AAPL this week...what else is new? This has happened so often over the last 18 years that I've finally become immune to it. Other than reinforcing my belief that folks who *trade* AAPL, or any other volatile stock, have more nerve, and are willing to risk losing more money than I am, these gyrations don't affect me. I do wish these "OMG, the sky is falling" drops would coincide with quarterly dividend payments, to allow more AAPL share purchases with dividends, and when the IRA RMD is calculated on 12/31 of each year. But even though that's not likely to happen, I'm content to hold AAPL, along with all the other AAPL Longs on the board, and echo what gtrplyr and since84 have already stated: "We are patient", "I'm all in" and "Cheers to the longs"!
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Post by macster on Apr 20, 2018 10:52:10 GMT -8
This drop is all my fault. I'm being punished for being materialistic lol. I made a planned purchase to reward myself and I would need the cash to complete the vehicle purchase within 10 days from this past wednesday including the time to clear the cash. I'll miss the divvy on these 100 shares but oh well not much. $12 drop Dammit.
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Post by nwjade on Apr 20, 2018 10:57:39 GMT -8
I have tried on numerous occasions to understand what the heck bitcoin mining is with little luck. I simply do not get it, all I know is investing in it is not for me. Now iPhones and iPads I know something about .... especially the iPhone X which is simply fantastic and light years ahead of any other phone I've ever used. Using my daughter's brand new iPhone 8 seems so antiquated at this point, when and if Apple does a cheaper version of iPhoneX it will sell in record numbers. What a crappy day ..... but we are used to it ... and we are patient. Cheers to the longs I view todays drop as a gift, a buying opportunity before the May 1 earnings release and the subsequent adjustments in cash return to the shareholders. I'm all in.Other opinions? Well someone has to do it ... Not much to say other than fears of lackluster iPhone numbers are putting pressure on our beloved stock.
Short sighted IMHO as this will be the quarter that Apple address what they will do with the recent Tax savings. May 1st can't come soon enough. Cheers to the longs ..... Maybe we should just close up shop now and open the bar? Rumors and panic causing a selloff of AAPL this week...what else is new? This has happened so often over the last 18 years that I've finally become immune to it. Other than reinforcing my belief that folks who *trade* AAPL, or any other volatile stock, have more nerve, and are willing to risk losing more money than I am, these gyrations don't affect me. I do wish these "OMG, the sky is falling" drops would coincide with quarterly dividend payments, to allow more AAPL share purchases with dividends, and when the IRA RMD is calculated on 12/31 of each year. But even though that's not likely to happen, I'm content to hold AAPL, along with all the other AAPL Longs on the board, and echo what gtrplyr and since84 have already stated: "We are patient", "I'm all in" and "Cheers to the longs"! Luckychoices, Thanks for your thoughts, tough couple of days. I've been invested in aapl for 12 years and still working on building up immunity to these swings. Since you mention RMD I'm wondering what your approach has been in timing your sale of shares to meet the requirement? (If you don't mind sharing) I'm going to have to join the RMD party in 2019 and feeling somewhat stressed over how to deal with it.
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Post by incorrigible on Apr 20, 2018 12:30:51 GMT -8
I do wish these "OMG, the sky is falling" drops would coincide with quarterly dividend payments, to allow more AAPL share purchases with dividends, Easily accomplished by turning off the DRIPs and just accumulate the dividends in cash and deploy when the BTFD opportunity arises. I don't DRIP any of my holdings. I accumulate the proceeds from dividends and then buy whatever stock offers the best value at the time and is consistent with my objectives when I hit a certain threshold.
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Post by Luckychoices on Apr 20, 2018 12:44:42 GMT -8
Rumors and panic causing a selloff of AAPL this week...what else is new? This has happened so often over the last 18 years that I've finally become immune to it. Other than reinforcing my belief that folks who *trade* AAPL, or any other volatile stock, have more nerve, and are willing to risk losing more money than I am, these gyrations don't affect me. I do wish these "OMG, the sky is falling" drops would coincide with quarterly dividend payments, to allow more AAPL share purchases with dividends, and when the IRA RMD is calculated on 12/31 of each year. But even though that's not likely to happen, I'm content to hold AAPL, along with all the other AAPL Longs on the board, and echo what gtrplyr and since84 have already stated: "We are patient", "I'm all in" and "Cheers to the longs"! Luckychoices, Thanks for your thoughts, tough couple of days. I've been invested in aapl for 12 years and still working on building up immunity to these swings. Since you mention RMD I'm wondering what your approach has been in timing your sale of shares to meet the requirement? (If you don't mind sharing) I'm going to have to join the RMD party in 2019 and feeling somewhat stressed over how to deal with it. Hi, nwjade! Don't stress! If you have enough AAPL or other shares in your IRA's to *worry* about stressing, you're probably well prepared financially to deal with it. I retired in 2008 when I was 66, and my wife retired in 2011 when she was 55. Consequently, I'm getting Social Security and she is not. Our income is the total from our two pensions, my Social Security, AAPL dividends from our trust accounts and my RMD withdrawal very year. As you may or may not know, if one is married, and their spouse is ten years or more *younger* than them, their RMD will be calculated from a different tax table and they'll pay *less* RMD for the following year. When I retired in 2008, we had no way of knowing Apple was going to reinstitute their dividend program, so our AAPL dividends were a surprising financial addition to our retirement income but has also, of course, added greatly to our yearly *taxable* income. The addition of my annual RMD requirement in 2014 or so has made our yearly taxable income even higher. Since one is not required to *sell* their stock to satisfy their RMD, my preference is always to *move* the AAPL shares to a trust account, keep receiving the dividends and having the amount added to our yearly taxes. Unfortunately, our increased tax demands usually mean *selling* the shares four times a year, just before our estimated federal and state taxes are due. We can't really time the selling to AAPL ATH's because of the required payment dates. Also, since we're both retired, we have higher expenses due to travel but those expenses can usually be timed to take advantage of higher AAPL share prices. I'm afraid I don't have any special way with dealing with the RMD other than what I've shared but will be happy to answer any further questions if I'm able. So don't stress about the RMD but be thankful that you've put yourself into a position to *have* have an RMD requirement. Unfortunately, many people haven't by the time they reach the 70's. Good luck! Don't stress! Cheers to the AAPL Longs!
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Post by pauls on Apr 20, 2018 12:48:31 GMT -8
I added at $166. I’ll add more if we see $150’s. The sky might be falling but Apple can afford to lift the sky.
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Post by nwjade on Apr 20, 2018 14:44:38 GMT -8
Luckychoices, Thanks for your thoughts, tough couple of days. I've been invested in aapl for 12 years and still working on building up immunity to these swings. Since you mention RMD I'm wondering what your approach has been in timing your sale of shares to meet the requirement? (If you don't mind sharing) I'm going to have to join the RMD party in 2019 and feeling somewhat stressed over how to deal with it. Hi, nwjade! Don't stress! If you have enough AAPL or other shares in your IRA's to *worry* about stressing, you're probably well prepared financially to deal with it. I retired in 2008 when I was 66, and my wife retired in 2011 when she was 55. Consequently, I'm getting Social Security and she is not. Our income is the total from our two pensions, my Social Security, AAPL dividends from our trust accounts and my RMD withdrawal very year. As you may or may not know, if one is married, and their spouse is ten years or more *younger* than them, their RMD will be calculated from a different tax table and they'll pay *less* RMD for the following year. When I retired in 2008, we had no way of knowing Apple was going to reinstitute their dividend program, so our AAPL dividends were a surprising financial addition to our retirement income but has also, of course, added greatly to our yearly *taxable* income. The addition of my annual RMD requirement in 2014 or so has made our yearly taxable income even higher. Since one is not required to *sell* their stock to satisfy their RMD, my preference is always to *move* the AAPL shares to a trust account, keep receiving the dividends and having the amount added to our yearly taxes. Unfortunately, our increased tax demands usually mean *selling* the shares four times a year, just before our estimated federal and state taxes are due. We can't really time the selling to AAPL ATH's because of the required payment dates. Also, since we're both retired, we have higher expenses due to travel but those expenses can usually be timed to take advantage of higher AAPL share prices. I'm afraid I don't have any special way with dealing with the RMD other than what I've shared but will be happy to answer any further questions if I'm able. So don't stress about the RMD but be thankful that you've put yourself into a position to *have* have an RMD requirement. Unfortunately, many people haven't by the time they reach the 70's. Good luck! Don't stress! Cheers to the AAPL Longs! Thanks for the reply. I retired in 2013 when I was 64 and supplementing my Social Security with Apple dividends. I went the concentrated investment route, aapl being my only stock holding from 2006, like I believe you've mentioned in previous posts. Before that in the 1997 to 2000 time frame I did the same thing with Dell. I feel rather like a scrooge when it comes to forced selling of Apple shares to meet RMD requirements. I just want to hold my shares and collect the dividends now more than ever (come on big divy increase) A good problem to have and yes I'm very thankful. I'll figure out a plan as it get closer.
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Post by carbonate24 on Apr 20, 2018 15:00:33 GMT -8
I added at $166. I’ll add more if we see $150’s. The sky might be falling but Apple can afford to lift the sky. Good call. I added more stock and some leaps with AAPL trading between 166-168. I kept some funds on the sideline in case this slide continues, but I think we’ll have to wait and see if any more analysts pile on the iphone shortfall story prior to earnings. At the very least, these last two days should increase the chances of a little bounce after AAPL reports.
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Post by Luckychoices on Apr 20, 2018 20:12:03 GMT -8
I do wish these "OMG, the sky is falling" drops would coincide with quarterly dividend payments, to allow more AAPL share purchases with dividends, Easily accomplished by turning off the DRIPs and just accumulate the dividends in cash and deploy when the BTFD opportunity arises. Good advice, I'm sure, incorrigible, but I don't trust that BTFD to *necessarily* occur before the next dividends are paid...or that I'll recognize it if it does. I proved to myself years ago that, if anyone can predict what AAPL is going to do in the short term, it isn't me. I don't DRIP any of my holdings. I accumulate the proceeds from dividends and then buy whatever stock offers the best value at the time and is consistent with my objectives when I hit a certain threshold. That's smart but my wife and I only buy AAPL. Many other stocks climb faster and many (most) pay a higher percentage dividend, but for the last 18 years we've been happy just staying with Apple. Your method is *much* more likely to bring better returns from your dividends but I guess I'm too comfortable with the non-thinking method. The way these last two market days have gone, we both may be buying more AAPL on a BTFD day.
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Post by appledoc on Apr 21, 2018 3:34:49 GMT -8
This is a gift from the gods to load up the truck before the dividend hike.
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Post by incorrigible on Apr 21, 2018 11:10:42 GMT -8
I guess I'm too comfortable with the non-thinking method. If I had your money, I'd feel and act the same way
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Post by Luckychoices on Apr 21, 2018 12:49:01 GMT -8
I guess I'm too comfortable with the non-thinking method. If I had your money, I'd feel and act the same way And if I were 45 instead of 75, I would probably use the *thinking* method.
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Post by incorrigible on Apr 21, 2018 13:15:17 GMT -8
If I had your money, I'd feel and act the same way And if I were 45 instead of 75, I would probably use the *thinking* method. I don't even remember 45
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Post by Luckychoices on Apr 21, 2018 15:15:47 GMT -8
And if I were 45 instead of 75, I would probably use the *thinking* method. I don't even remember 45 I can't truthfully say I remember *being* 45, but I very much remember *turning* 45: I had not been looking forward to my 45th birthday and a good work friend(an ancient guy, 62 years old), a very kindly, soft-spoken design engineer who everyone liked, came up to me one day at work and said, "What's going on with you, Ron? You've not been your normal self lately. You're very quiet and don't seem to have much to say." I said, "Well, I'm kind of freaking out, Lyle. Next week I turn 45 and I can't help feeling I'll be half way to 50." Lyle smiled his sly smile and quietly said, "According to my calculations, Ron, you'll be half way to 90." I laughed that day and many times since, remembering that conversation. ;-)
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JDSoCal
Member
Aspiring oligarch
Posts: 4,189
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Post by JDSoCal on Apr 22, 2018 22:48:55 GMT -8
Luckychoices, Thanks for your thoughts, tough couple of days. I've been invested in aapl for 12 years and still working on building up immunity to these swings. Since you mention RMD I'm wondering what your approach has been in timing your sale of shares to meet the requirement? (If you don't mind sharing) I'm going to have to join the RMD party in 2019 and feeling somewhat stressed over how to deal with it. Hi, nwjade! Don't stress! If you have enough AAPL or other shares in your IRA's to *worry* about stressing, you're probably well prepared financially to deal with it. I retired in 2008 when I was 66, and my wife retired in 2011 when she was 55. Consequently, I'm getting Social Security and she is not. Our income is the total from our two pensions, my Social Security, AAPL dividends from our trust accounts and my RMD withdrawal very year. As you may or may not know, if one is married, and their spouse is ten years or more *younger* than them, their RMD will be calculated from a different tax table and they'll pay *less* RMD for the following year. When I retired in 2008, we had no way of knowing Apple was going to reinstitute their dividend program, so our AAPL dividends were a surprising financial addition to our retirement income but has also, of course, added greatly to our yearly *taxable* income. The addition of my annual RMD requirement in 2014 or so has made our yearly taxable income even higher. Since one is not required to *sell* their stock to satisfy their RMD, my preference is always to *move* the AAPL shares to a trust account, keep receiving the dividends and having the amount added to our yearly taxes. Unfortunately, our increased tax demands usually mean *selling* the shares four times a year, just before our estimated federal and state taxes are due. We can't really time the selling to AAPL ATH's because of the required payment dates. Also, since we're both retired, we have higher expenses due to travel but those expenses can usually be timed to take advantage of higher AAPL share prices. I'm afraid I don't have any special way with dealing with the RMD other than what I've shared but will be happy to answer any further questions if I'm able. So don't stress about the RMD but be thankful that you've put yourself into a position to *have* have an RMD requirement. Unfortunately, many people haven't by the time they reach the 70's. Good luck! Don't stress! Cheers to the AAPL Longs! Why did I think you had AAPL shares in a Roth?
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Post by Luckychoices on Apr 23, 2018 21:18:19 GMT -8
Hi, nwjade! Don't stress! If you have enough AAPL or other shares in your IRA's to *worry* about stressing, you're probably well prepared financially to deal with it. I retired in 2008 when I was 66, and my wife retired in 2011 when she was 55. Consequently, I'm getting Social Security and she is not. Our income is the total from our two pensions, my Social Security, AAPL dividends from our trust accounts and my RMD withdrawal very year. As you may or may not know, if one is married, and their spouse is ten years or more *younger* than them, their RMD will be calculated from a different tax table and they'll pay *less* RMD for the following year. When I retired in 2008, we had no way of knowing Apple was going to reinstitute their dividend program, so our AAPL dividends were a surprising financial addition to our retirement income but has also, of course, added greatly to our yearly *taxable* income. The addition of my annual RMD requirement in 2014 or so has made our yearly taxable income even higher. Since one is not required to *sell* their stock to satisfy their RMD, my preference is always to *move* the AAPL shares to a trust account, keep receiving the dividends and having the amount added to our yearly taxes. Unfortunately, our increased tax demands usually mean *selling* the shares four times a year, just before our estimated federal and state taxes are due. We can't really time the selling to AAPL ATH's because of the required payment dates. Also, since we're both retired, we have higher expenses due to travel but those expenses can usually be timed to take advantage of higher AAPL share prices. I'm afraid I don't have any special way with dealing with the RMD other than what I've shared but will be happy to answer any further questions if I'm able. So don't stress about the RMD but be thankful that you've put yourself into a position to *have* have an RMD requirement. Unfortunately, many people haven't by the time they reach the 70's. Good luck! Don't stress! Cheers to the AAPL Longs! Why did I think you had AAPL shares in a Roth? Don't have any idea, JD. When we were both still working, we discovered that our company, Lockheed Martin, allowed anyone over 50 to invest up to 70% of their 401K into any stock they desired, instead of picking from the list of 8-10 approved investments. We both *immediately* put 70% into AAPL and when each of us retired, we rolled that money over into a regular IRA. We had each been contributing to a regular IRA prior to rolling our 401K's so we ended up with about 62% of our AAPL in IRA's and the rest in trust accounts. So, not Roth but still decent.
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