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Post by CdnPhoto on Mar 23, 2024 4:21:02 GMT -8
Starting the weekend thread. Please remember to keep it civil.
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chinacat
Moderator
AAPL Long since 2006
Posts: 4,431
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Post by chinacat on Mar 23, 2024 7:57:59 GMT -8
I found this article “UPDATE Apple accused of monopolizing smartphone markets in US antitrust lawsuit” to be quite surprising/confusing. Here are a few examples: “The Justice Department said that Apple charges as much as $1,599 for an iPhone and makes larger profit than any others in the industry.”. First, this is not unusual. There are companies in various markets that do the same, because they can due to the the quality and/or usefulness of their product. Also, “Officials also said Apple charges various business partners - from software developers to credit card companies and even its rivals such as Google - behind the scenes in ways that ultimately raise prices for consumers and drive up Apple's profit.”. Ditto - it’s called capitalism. The fact that Apple plays the game particularly well is not (or should not IMHO) be illegal. Rivals who find the prices untenable need to find a strategy that enables them to compete in a free market.
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aapl
fire starter
Posts: 184
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Post by aapl on Mar 23, 2024 8:38:20 GMT -8
Very nice summary by Evercore.
==================================== Posted Friday night by Barrons:
Why Apple Will Prevail
These reports, excerpted and edited by Barron’s, were issued recently by investment and research firms. The reports are a sampling of analysts’ thinking; they should not be considered the views or recommendations of Barron’s. Some of the reports’ issuers have provided, or hope to provide, investment-banking or other services to the companies being analyzed.
Apple • AAPL-Nasdaq Outperform • Price $178.67 on March 21 by Evercore ISI
The Department of Justice has filed its long-telegraphed suit against Apple, and it will doubtless be a long process that will produce negative headlines, but we think that Apple will prevail in the end. The DOJ has been aggressive in pursuing antitrust suits against Big Tech, though with limited success. We continue to think that any meaningful antitrust action against Apple in the U.S. will require new legislation from Congress, as existing laws make it very difficult to argue that Apple operates a monopoly using market definitions or consumer-harm standards. The Epic Games lawsuit attacked similar angles and was struck down because the judge would not define iOS as a single market. Similarly, Apple does not have a monopoly on the broader smartphone or digital gaming markets. The DOJ case is broader but will still ultimately hinge on defining market (is the market iOS or all smartphones?) and producing evidence showing that Apple’s actions directly harmed competition and consumers. It will likely take two to three years for the initial lawsuit to conclude, followed by one year for the appeals process. Net/net: We continue to view antitrust as more of a headline risk than a financial risk in the U.S., and unless we see new legislation passed, it is unlikely that Apple will be forced to meaningfully change its App Store fee or third-party App Store polices. We main our Outperform rating and $220 target.
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Dave
Member
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." Yogi Berra
Posts: 4,111
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Post by Dave on Mar 24, 2024 2:15:51 GMT -8
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Dave
Member
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." Yogi Berra
Posts: 4,111
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Post by Dave on Mar 24, 2024 2:23:05 GMT -8
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Dave
Member
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." Yogi Berra
Posts: 4,111
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Post by Dave on Mar 24, 2024 3:56:12 GMT -8
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Post by Lstream on Mar 24, 2024 4:17:41 GMT -8
On the sales side, is it your position that Apple should not sell its products there?
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Post by CdnPhoto on Mar 24, 2024 5:36:55 GMT -8
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Post by CdnPhoto on Mar 24, 2024 5:38:35 GMT -8
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Post by Lstream on Mar 24, 2024 6:32:09 GMT -8
Emerging legal consensus is that Apple will prevail here. What a waste of taxpayer money. Letting a bunch of anti-capitalism zealots run loose. Who apparently think that their job now includes helping weak competitors. Samsung must be real pleased, for government to act against a huge domestic success story. You can be sure this would never be allowed in Korea.
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Post by CdnPhoto on Mar 24, 2024 6:54:57 GMT -8
Emerging legal consensus is that Apple will prevail here. What a waste of taxpayer money. Letting a bunch of anti-capitalism zealots run loose. Who apparently think that their job now includes helping weak competitors. Samsung must be real pleased, for government to act against a huge domestic success story. You can be sure this would never be allowed in Korea. I wonder how much Samsung and Google spent on lobbying?
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Dave
Member
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." Yogi Berra
Posts: 4,111
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Post by Dave on Mar 24, 2024 8:55:51 GMT -8
On the sales side, is it your position that Apple should not sell its products there? Perhaps you missed my point. If the Chinese dictator decides to ban the sales of Apple products the affect on Apples bottom line would be painful along with the share price. But Apple would recover. But if China were to start to shut down Apples manufacturing what would Apple look like? This is the danger of putting most of your eggs into that one basket. Is this scenario possible, yes, but hopefully unlikely. It all depends on one person, Chairman Xi. Also, I’ve decided to take yours, Chinacat and Teds advise by starting to unravel my position in AAPL. Not that it will be noticeable by Mr. Market.
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Post by nwjade on Mar 24, 2024 9:11:10 GMT -8
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Dave
Member
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." Yogi Berra
Posts: 4,111
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Post by Dave on Mar 24, 2024 9:12:30 GMT -8
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Dave
Member
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." Yogi Berra
Posts: 4,111
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Post by Dave on Mar 24, 2024 9:35:28 GMT -8
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coma
Member
Posts: 522
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Post by coma on Mar 24, 2024 9:35:51 GMT -8
Popcorn, Popcorn . . . step right up and get your Fresh Hot Popcorn right here folks ! And keep coming back, I'll be selling Fresh Hot Popcorn for years from this very spot, get your Fresh Hot Popcorn before I run out of Fresh Hot Popcorn ! Popcorn, Popcorn . . .
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Dave
Member
"It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future." Yogi Berra
Posts: 4,111
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Post by Dave on Mar 24, 2024 9:45:30 GMT -8
The problem with fighting the federal government is that they have an endless supply of resources. “ You can’t fight city hall.”
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Post by nwjade on Mar 24, 2024 11:25:36 GMT -8
It seems to me the longer the DOJ case is drawn out (years?) the higher the likelihood of it becoming more and more of a nothing burger. Apple will study all charges under a microscope and evolve any of the items with merit (if there are any?) with updated technology/practices to make the case irrelevant as possible...
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Post by Lstream on Mar 24, 2024 12:38:42 GMT -8
Sounds like that is the best choice for you. Doesn’t make sense to hold, once faith in leadership is gone.
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Post by deasys on Mar 24, 2024 13:03:27 GMT -8
Interesting! So I guess tomorrow we should expect INTC (P/E of 110) and AMD (P/E of 333) to drop 10%, multiplied by some enormous factor that recognizes their massive overvaluations. Silly me—here I am expecting the market to be rational, fair, and consistent…
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