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Post by rob_london on May 21, 2013 9:20:42 GMT -8
Very impressed by TC's performance.
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Mav
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Post by Mav on May 21, 2013 9:20:49 GMT -8
Tim standing strong.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2013 9:21:30 GMT -8
Tim needs to tell Levin that Apple has RECORDED its intention to bring the profits home -- it's TIMING. If Apple NEVER intended to bring the money home, it would not have recorded the deferred tax liability. But it did, unlike other multinational companies. Sheesh.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2013 9:22:25 GMT -8
They need a GAAP guy on that panel to explain this to Levin.
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JDSoCal
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Aspiring oligarch
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Post by JDSoCal on May 21, 2013 9:22:49 GMT -8
"We've got $100B in profits sitting there." - Levin
Who's "we" fatboy?
This is how they think, it's their money.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2013 9:22:59 GMT -8
I'd love to see TC respond to Levin's self serving stance by saying, "Apple is managing its financial affairs to take advantage of, and in compliance with, the tax laws that you spearheaded over the last 20+ years".
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Post by yellowhandman on May 21, 2013 9:23:25 GMT -8
Tim Cook should ask : "Senator, are you accusing our company of illegal conduct? If not, then what are you talking about?"
This is not a criticism of TC. This is meant to highlight how stupid Levin's questions are, from a lawyer's (yes, that's me) point of view.
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Post by rlo on May 21, 2013 9:23:45 GMT -8
Levin trying to move this meeting to his favor, but really just coming off as a bully as usual.
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Post by fas550 on May 21, 2013 9:24:44 GMT -8
He should tell him there is a plan to bring the cash home otherwise he would not have paid partial taxes on that money. Why would he pay partial taxes on income he has NO intention of bringing back to the country he has paid partial taxes on.
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Mav
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Post by Mav on May 21, 2013 9:25:41 GMT -8
Again with the legal/illegal BS.
Well the IRS says it's fine but I can't make that judgment...
Agenda much?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2013 9:26:01 GMT -8
Tim needs to tell Levin that Apple has RECORDED its intention to bring the profits home -- it's TIMING. If Apple NEVER intended to bring the money home, it would not have recorded the deferred tax liability. But it did, unlike other multinational companies. Sheesh. That position is simply compliance with GAAP rules. Compliance in this manner must meet a GAAP test.
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Post by artman1033 on May 21, 2013 9:26:36 GMT -8
CAN we all agree.....
WE ALL love the iPhone and the iPad.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2013 9:26:57 GMT -8
You're not "shifting" anything if the policy and practice has remained in place for 30 years.
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Mav
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Post by Mav on May 21, 2013 9:27:21 GMT -8
You moron! IP is why profits aren't in your hands? Int'l Sales 101
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Mav
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Post by Mav on May 21, 2013 9:28:30 GMT -8
Well Mercel they continued the process in 2008. I demand a subcommittee hearing! ;D
TC should say: "Sen. Levin. Give me your iPhone. We'll refund you because you don't get our company."
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2013 9:28:52 GMT -8
Tim needs to tell Levin that Apple has RECORDED its intention to bring the profits home -- it's TIMING. If Apple NEVER intended to bring the money home, it would not have recorded the deferred tax liability. But it did, unlike other multinational companies. Sheesh. That position is simply compliance with GAAP rules. Compliance in this manner must meet a GAAP test. Auditors had an easy sign off because Apple wasn't attempting an argument they wouldn't bring the profits home -- at some point in the future. There is discretion and a threshold to meet. Dammit Levin, it's a tax deferral!
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Post by fas550 on May 21, 2013 9:29:45 GMT -8
How about, we made a decision based on the laws you, your chamber and previous colleagues wrote.
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Post by nathanstevens on May 21, 2013 9:30:17 GMT -8
TC appears to be the smartest and calmest guy in the room. Exercising great restraint right now.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2013 9:30:19 GMT -8
Levin is beating a dead horse of irrelevance. His current questioning is pure grandstanding that has nothing to do with the fact that US tax code (which he is largely responsible) is dysfunctional.
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Mav
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Post by Mav on May 21, 2013 9:34:28 GMT -8
Cook's trying to hide his contempt.
So Tesla should clearly pay 100% US taxes. Because the research is in the US right? Never mind sales mix!
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Mav
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Post by Mav on May 21, 2013 9:36:11 GMT -8
So nonsensical.
Clearly big US companies should do R&D outside the US. Problem solved.
Oh, but US ties? Fine, no US R&D types. All foreign national researchers. Somehow I doubt that would satisfy Sen. Levin.
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Post by moltenfire on May 21, 2013 9:36:18 GMT -8
I'm sure the politicians know that, but they also know that politically, it's going to look horrible and that's why it's not going to be done. Gas prices are going to go up with VAT. Joe sixpack's going to go on TV and say now because of the change in taxes, his food's more expensive, his guns are more expensive, and he can't afford his lifestyle anymore because of the damn VAT. Not being critical of you specifically, but your statement underlines the gross misunderstanding of the impact of taxing production. Elimination of production taxes on US produced goods would reduce the cost of those goods by ~25%. Applying a consumption tax on top of that lowered cost would result in virtually the same ASP as before. By adopting the SAME tax policy as our foreign competitors, the ASP of items produced outside of the US would increase, making US produced goods more competitive domestically and internationally. I'm taking a cynical view here. You're assuming that US domestic companies will pass 100% of their tax savings to their consumers, whereas I think the companies will charge the same price, and let the politicians take the fall for the added VAT.
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Post by prazan on May 21, 2013 9:36:22 GMT -8
Levin (I purposely omit the honorific) comes across as a bullying clown. What is he trying to achieve? The other three senators on the panel I heard speak (McKaskill, Johnson, Portman, plus Paul) took positions contrary to Levin and McCain. So I don't understand, in the end, Levin's political point, or rather, he's botched the politics of this.
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Post by sponge on May 21, 2013 9:36:57 GMT -8
Just bought more stock now that we are green. You said on Friday you made your last buy for awhile... Changed my mind. Actually I bought more calls yesterday as well. I am feeling bullish.
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Post by tuffett on May 21, 2013 9:39:06 GMT -8
Levin is an absolute fuckwit. Shouldn't the chairman have at least some semblance of impartiality and actually allow panel members to make their points without interruption every three seconds?
What a turd. Please jump off a cliff, Levin.
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JDSoCal
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Aspiring oligarch
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Post by JDSoCal on May 21, 2013 9:40:33 GMT -8
Levin is too dumb to see the lunacy of claiming that Apple has these amazing benefits of being HQ'd in the US, as it has the highest tax rates in the world, while he tries to tax overseas sales in a way no other country does. Apple would be better off HQ'd in another country! That is what we have come to.
I really wish someone from Apple would just state the obvious to this fat blowhard: Why should a company that makes and sells a product overseas owe any tax to the US treasury? Fine, tax the US shareholder once he gets his divy check; but why, Fat Bastard Senator, are you entitled to a cut of something happening 100% in China?
And yeah, Apple is really enjoying those "patent protections" Senator Fat Dunderhead. Too bad Cook didn't point out, "Actually, Senator, we're getting ripped off shamelessly by our competitors, as you have completely fucked up the patent system as well."
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Post by The Big Toe on May 21, 2013 9:40:39 GMT -8
I am imagining that the word "shift" was pushed into many of Levin's witness's talking points.
Shift, shift, shift... Can anyone use the word "transfer"?
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Post by fas550 on May 21, 2013 9:40:56 GMT -8
Levin (I purposely omit the honorific) comes across as a bullying clown. What is he trying to achieve? The other three senators on the panel I heard speak (McKaskill, Johnson, Portman, plus Paul) took positions contrary to Levin and McCain. So I don't understand, in the end, Levin's political point, or rather, he's botched the politics of this. He's pissed because the tone of the hearing isn't going his way. He came to beat to death how horrible multinational companies are greedy and do nothing but take money from taxpayers. It's appeals to the lowest common denomination of human psyche; good vs bad, big vs small etc...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2013 9:41:22 GMT -8
I think this morning's dip was a hedge against the possibility that these hearings could end up going bad for Apple. When it became apparent that the only losers were Levin and McCain, AAPL rebounded with strength. Essentially the market voted, with its pocketbook, that Levin and McCain were the two dumbest people in the room.
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SomeJuan
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Taking a nap…
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Post by SomeJuan on May 21, 2013 9:54:30 GMT -8
I ask every member here to write a comment to Senator Levin, re: todays sub-commitee hearing. Everyone take 5 minutes! To make it easy, here is the link.... Senator Levin's email
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