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Post by greedynoob on Jan 28, 2014 13:19:33 GMT -8
Does anyone really think that a few amateurs guessing at EPS and Sales is the reason Apple is down so much today? Uhm, way more than just the amateurs were predicting well above Apple's own guidance...
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Post by cbingle on Jan 28, 2014 13:37:50 GMT -8
I was going to put this exact point in a letter to Tim.
I am sure Tim is waiting with baited breath.
Here is my recommendation to Tim....
....sleep in till 5 am, cause getting up at 3:45 to read e-mails ain't workin.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2014 13:43:40 GMT -8
Does anyone really think that a few amateurs guessing at EPS and Sales is the reason Apple is down so much today? Uhm, way more than just the amateurs were predicting well above Apple's own guidance... And Apple has made it painfully aware over the past year that they're no longer a growth company...best case is they're IBM or Microsoft now, with Share prices increasing only because of the massive cash flow coming in which is sent back to Shareholders via Dividends and Buybacks. Nothing wrong with it...Apple has plenty of cash they can give back.
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Post by cbingle on Jan 28, 2014 13:49:09 GMT -8
Look just because you weren't in the know enough to sell your remaining "1500" shares don't lay it off on us. I can understand your whining but you left the 75k on the table. So put on your big boy shirt, accept responsibility and try to act like an adult. You are not on my list of people that I have to justify my actions to so judge away----you are all by yourself in that courtroom.
Calm down. Happy to lend you my big boy shirt (what ever the F that means)
PS: I sold 300 shares at $553 yesterday afternoon. Only have 1200 shares now.
Pay attention.
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Post by rickag on Jan 28, 2014 14:08:31 GMT -8
Look just because you weren't in the know enough to sell your remaining "1500" shares don't lay it off on us. I can understand your whining but you left the 75k on the table. So put on your big boy shirt, accept responsibility and try to act like an adult. You are not on my list of people that I have to justify my actions to so judge away----you are all by yourself in that courtroom. Calm down. Happy to lend you my big boy shirt (what ever the F that means) PS: I sold 300 shares at $553 yesterday afternoon. Only have 1200 shares now. Pay attention. Serious question, why hold onto 1200 shares? Do you expect a reversal of any size in the near future? I can easily see AAPL drop to a P/E around 10 in the current quarter, just like it did months ago. Me, I'm debating with myself about getting out completely.
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Post by cbingle on Jan 28, 2014 14:18:42 GMT -8
21 minutes ago cbingle said: Look just because you weren't in the know enough to sell your remaining "1500" shares don't lay it off on us. I can understand your whining but you left the 75k on the table. So put on your big boy shirt, accept responsibility and try to act like an adult. You are not on my list of people that I have to justify my actions to so judge away----you are all by yourself in that courtroom.
Calm down. Happy to lend you my big boy shirt (what ever the F that means)
PS: I sold 300 shares at $553 yesterday afternoon. Only have 1200 shares now.
Pay attention.
Serious question, why hold onto 1200 shares? Do you expect a reversal of any size in the near future?
I can easily see AAPL drop to a P/E around 10 in the current quarter, just like it did months ago.
Me, I'm debating with myself about getting out completely.
Mostly because I am in a transitional state. Retired at 57, living off of dividends and capital gains. I paid over $150,000 in taxes in 2012, so got tired of main stream America.
I managed my accounts to pay no taxes in 2013. Made over $120,000 in capital gains, but with deduction, etc, had capital gains less than $70,000, so no taxes.
I am selling shares in my IRA, but cannot sell more in my trading account unless I pay taxes. I have paid so much in taxes the last few years, I have made it a goal not to give the IRS any more money.
Ironically, kinda like Apple.
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Post by rickag on Jan 28, 2014 14:54:10 GMT -8
cbingle
Thanks for the reply.
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JDSoCal
Member
Aspiring oligarch
Posts: 4,189
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Post by JDSoCal on Jan 28, 2014 15:09:20 GMT -8
Does anyone really think that a few amateurs guessing at EPS and Sales is the reason Apple is down so much today? Uhm, way more than just the amateurs were predicting well above Apple's own guidance... Which is way more than anything I implied here. One more time, I can point out that these guys are inaccurate without suggesting any cause and effect on Apple's share price. But it might affect some people's investment decisions. I just hope we can all agree that the amateur analysts won't be our financial advisers.
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Post by artman1033 on Jan 28, 2014 15:35:43 GMT -8
10-Q isup!940,692,000 shares of common stock were issued and outstanding as of October 19, 2012. 939,058,000 shares of common stock issued and outstanding as of January 11, 2013 938,649,000 shares of common stock issued and outstanding as of April 12, 2013 908,497,000 shares of common stock issued and outstanding as of July 12, 2013 899,738,000 shares of common stock issued and outstanding as of October 18th, 2013 891,989,000 shares of common stock issued and outstanding as of January 10, 2014 945,355,000 Diluted shares of common stock outstanding as of September 29, 2012 947,217,000 Diluted shares of common stock outstanding as of December 29, 2012 946,035,000 Diluted shares of common stock outstanding as of March 30, 2013 924,265,000 Diluted shares of common stock outstanding as of June 29, 2013 931,662,000 Diluted shares of common stock outstanding as of September 28th, 2013 901,452,000 Diluted shares of common stock outstanding as of December 28th, 2013 www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/320193/000119312513416534/d590790d10k.htmaaplfinance.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=intradayupdates&thread=577&page=4#56278
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Post by cbingle on Jan 28, 2014 15:39:44 GMT -8
Rickag
No problem
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Post by greedynoob on Jan 28, 2014 16:09:03 GMT -8
So, question, purely out of curiosity.:If you had magically known the day before how badly AAPL would perform after earnings, would you have gone ahead and sold out and taken the tax hit?
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mark
fire starter
Posts: 1,574
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Post by mark on Jan 28, 2014 16:25:58 GMT -8
Ichan bought another $500 million in AAPL. Glutton for punishment? Punishment? He's probably still up $250-350M!!!
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mark
fire starter
Posts: 1,574
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Post by mark on Jan 28, 2014 16:33:41 GMT -8
Mostly because I am in a transitional state. Retired at 57, living off of dividends and capital gains. I paid over $150,000 in taxes in 2012, so got tired of main stream America. I managed my accounts to pay no taxes in 2013. Made over $120,000 in capital gains, but with deduction, etc, had capital gains less than $70,000, so no taxes. I am selling shares in my IRA, but cannot sell more in my trading account unless I pay taxes. I have paid so much in taxes the last few years, I have made it a goal not to give the IRS any more money. Ironically, kinda like Apple. The second or third rule of investing is "don't let the tax tail wag the investing dog." Some of my worst investing mistakes were making decisions due to tax ramifications/dates. One of my goals in life is to pay 7 figures in taxes some year
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Post by greedynoob on Jan 28, 2014 17:02:08 GMT -8
Well, what the hell, I just thought I'd point out that AT&T beat the street and is now down in after-hours. Welcome to bizarro-world ;-)
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Post by incorrigible on Jan 28, 2014 17:23:52 GMT -8
So, question, purely out of curiosity.:If you had magically known the day before how badly AAPL would perform after earnings, would you have gone ahead and sold out and taken the tax hit? Absolutely. Sell. Pay tax. Re-buy $40+ lower in price. Gotta pay the tax man sometime anyway. The savings of selling/buying would pay quite a large chunk on the tax bill and that would no longer be an albatross hanging over your neck affecting future decisions. Just my humble opinion. Peace. Edit: Wrong (ea)ffecting
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Post by incorrigible on Jan 28, 2014 17:25:26 GMT -8
Well, what the hell, I just thought I'd point out that AT&T beat the street and is now down in after-hours. Welcome to bizarro-world ;-) Same with VMWare. The market seems broken.
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Post by greedynoob on Jan 28, 2014 17:32:11 GMT -8
Well, what the hell, I just thought I'd point out that AT&T beat the street and is now down in after-hours. Welcome to bizarro-world ;-) Same with VMWare. The market seems broken. Lousy durable goods report, fear of Fed taper...
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Post by terps530 on Jan 28, 2014 18:05:29 GMT -8
not the best day to put me in a good mood for my phone interview with apple any minute now... ! palms sweating just like an earnings day lol
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Post by prazan on Jan 28, 2014 18:24:44 GMT -8
not the best day to put me in a good mood for my phone interview with apple any minute now... ! palms sweating just like an earnings day lol Best of luck on the call!
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JDSoCal
Member
Aspiring oligarch
Posts: 4,189
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Post by JDSoCal on Jan 28, 2014 18:50:10 GMT -8
So, question, purely out of curiosity.:If you had magically known the day before how badly AAPL would perform after earnings, would you have gone ahead and sold out and taken the tax hit? Impossible question is impossible to answer. 1) Apple is down 8% today because the "best" analysts in the world cannot predict such things, let alone the worst ones, let alone lowly AFB denizens with insufficient cranial capacity to be members of the Braeburn Braintrustâ„¢. So there is no way any of us could have known, unless one of us were having pillow talk with Peter Oppenheimer. And most of the gains would have to be spent on years of therapy and criminal defense lawyer fees in that event anyway. The takeaway is, you can't know, so be agnostic going into earnings. 2) Without knowing one's cost basis and total gains, this question is unanswerable even if 1) was. Tax liabilities can more than double based on how much gains/AGI you have. The bottom long term rate is 0%, while the top is 20% - the latter rate being 25% higher above $250K than below it! And this doesn't even count the rape that some states like mine commit. So "sell for gains and pay taxes?" isn't a binary question. 3) Without declaring one's age/time horizon, marital status*, risk tolerance, and other assets, this question is unanswerable even if 1), 2), and 3) were. *If one spouse dies, the other gets a cost basis step-up for tax purposes. 4) Without declaring another unknowable, whether AAPL will ever go above Monday's closing price, this question is unanswerable even if 1), 2), and 3) were. So while we are partaking in hindsight, kindly tell me APPL's ATH over the next 10 years, TIA. Not trying to be facetious or snarky here. Tax planning is very complex, not binary.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2014 18:53:25 GMT -8
Stunned by three things:
1. 51M iPhones (low) 2. ASPs on iPads (low) and ASP on iPhones (high) 3. WS reaction to Apple posting 23B in cash from operations, hitting near the top of Rev. guidance, beating margin (including guidance), and improving EPS YOY.
Sorry, but WS is so F'd up with the current analysts flapping their gums. These guys do not have the education nor the training to be telling Apple what it should do, much less opine on its value. It's disgusting.
Finally, I hope Apple stops reporting unit sales. It's stupid, giving WS the rope with which to hang Tim Cook and Peter Oppenheimer. And that goes for armchair analysts -- please stop feeding the expectation bubble that's hurting AAPL.
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Post by cbingle on Jan 28, 2014 19:05:08 GMT -8
greedynoob Member
Posts: 40
2 hours ago ReplyQuotePost by greedynoob on 2 hours ago So, question, purely out of curiosity.:If you had magically known the day before how badly AAPL would perform after earnings, would you have gone ahead and sold out and taken the tax hit?
If that is directed at me. Yes.
Looking to sell everything at new product announcement. Anything close to $550 and it is gone. Happy to pay taxes and move on.
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Post by greedynoob on Jan 28, 2014 19:32:17 GMT -8
Not trying to be facetious or snarky here. Tax planning is very complex, not binary. Because of where my question appeared in the stream, it was not clear that I was not posing that as a general question, but was directing it specifically to cbingle.
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Post by mcharliem on Jan 28, 2014 19:41:38 GMT -8
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Post by cbingle on Jan 28, 2014 19:45:58 GMT -8
3 hours ago ReplyQuotePost by mark on 3 hours ago
5 hours ago cbingle said:
Mostly because I am in a transitional state. Retired at 57, living off of dividends and capital gains. I paid over $150,000 in taxes in 2012, so got tired of main stream America.
I managed my accounts to pay no taxes in 2013. Made over $120,000 in capital gains, but with deduction, etc, had capital gains less than $70,000, so no taxes.
I am selling shares in my IRA, but cannot sell more in my trading account unless I pay taxes. I have paid so much in taxes the last few years, I have made it a goal not to give the IRS any more money.
Ironically, kinda like Apple.
The second or third rule of investing is "don't let the tax tail wag the investing dog." Some of my worst investing mistakes were making decisions due to tax ramifications/dates.
One of my goals in life is to pay 7 figures in taxes some year
Mine was too, until you have to pay it. Your outlook will change if that ever happens.
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Post by ericinaustin on Jan 28, 2014 20:12:50 GMT -8
greedynoob Member Posts: 40 2 hours ago ReplyQuotePost by greedynoob on 2 hours ago So, question, purely out of curiosity.:If you had magically known the day before how badly AAPL would perform after earnings, would you have gone ahead and sold out and taken the tax hit? If that is directed at me. Yes. Looking to sell everything at new product announcement. Anything close to $550 and it is gone. Happy to pay taxes and move on. You'll regret that in a year. Better yet. Copy this one and come back in 12 to 15 months and admit it. You're letting Ben Grahms. Mr. Market influence you way too much.
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Post by cbingle on Jan 28, 2014 20:21:21 GMT -8
5 minutes ago via the ProBoards App ReplyQuotePost by ericinaustin on 5 minutes ago
about an hour ago cbingle said: greedynoob Member
Posts: 40
2 hours ago ReplyQuotePost by greedynoob on 2 hours ago So, question, purely out of curiosity.:If you had magically known the day before how badly AAPL would perform after earnings, would you have gone ahead and sold out and taken the tax hit?
If that is directed at me. Yes.
Looking to sell everything at new product announcement. Anything close to $550 and it is gone. Happy to pay taxes and move on.
You'll regret that in a year. Better yet. Copy this one and come back in 12 to 15 months and admit it. You're letting Ben Grahms. Mr. Market influence you way too much.
Will do. Hope you are still here then. I will be the first to acknowledge a F up. However, I already have investment plans for that money.
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Post by Nevyn on Jan 28, 2014 20:43:54 GMT -8
not the best day to put me in a good mood for my phone interview with apple any minute now... ! palms sweating just like an earnings day lol Interview? What position? A friend if mine just went through the process and will be starting Cupertino in a few weeks. He knows his role but not exactly what he will be working on.
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JDSoCal
Member
Aspiring oligarch
Posts: 4,189
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Post by JDSoCal on Jan 28, 2014 20:56:45 GMT -8
Looking to sell everything at new product announcement. Anything close to $550 and it is gone. Happy to pay taxes and move on. Speaking of moving on, you've decided Apple is no longer an investment you want any part of. So please, what legitimate purpose do you have frequenting this AAPL Finance Board, let alone posting on it 5+ times per day? I'm not asking you to leave. I'm just asking what possible reason other than trolling AAPL longs (and Vette owners) you could have to be posting here? Serious question.
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platon
Member
"All we can know is that we know nothing. And that's the height of human wisdom.? Tolstoy
Posts: 3,944
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Post by platon on Jan 29, 2014 6:18:02 GMT -8
Look just because you weren't in the know enough to sell your remaining "1500" shares don't lay it off on us. I can understand your whining but you left the 75k on the table. So put on your big boy shirt, accept responsibility and try to act like an adult. You are not on my list of people that I have to justify my actions to so judge away----you are all by yourself in that courtroom. Calm down. Happy to lend you my big boy shirt (what ever the F that means) PS: I sold 300 shares at $553 yesterday afternoon. Only have 1200 shares now. Pay attention. BBS=Any shirt that buttons up which often confounds anyone under 4 years old or who is 57 years old, independently wealthy, retired and trolls forums with the express purpose of agitating. I don't really care if you have 1200 or 12000 shares and since I work for a living I don't pay a lot of attention so why don't you try and be a little more informational and a little less confrontational and maybe your message would have a little more meaning. That said I hope you are able to UN-attach yourself from AAPL successfully.
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